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Willie T
Average Member

136 Posts

Posted - Jul 04 2017 :  19:44:13  Show Profile Send Willie T a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Anybody done much with the new enduron? I just picked up a 1 lb can of 4451 to try in my 270.

Willie T---Lone Star State

Zero333
Advanced Member



Canada
810 Posts

Posted - Jul 05 2017 :  00:55:19  Show Profile Send Zero333 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I tried 7977 in one of my 300winmag's.

Got good velocity, but could not match the accuracy of H-4831.

Treat that trigger like itís your first date, not like youíve been married to it for 20 years.
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Willie T
Average Member

136 Posts

Posted - Jul 05 2017 :  09:42:19  Show Profile Send Willie T a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thanks for the reply zero. H 4831 and IMR 4350 are what I am checking to see how it stacks up to.

Willie T---Lone Star State
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RaySendero
Advanced Member



USA
635 Posts

Posted - Jul 05 2017 :  12:13:45  Show Profile Send RaySendero a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Willie T

Thanks for the reply zero. H 4831 and IMR 4350 are what I am checking to see how it stacks up to.




IMR-4350 is my "go to" powder for 150 gr bullets in my 270, also.

Ray
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Willie T
Average Member

136 Posts

Posted - Jul 05 2017 :  23:10:25  Show Profile Send Willie T a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thanks for the reply Ray. I have a really consistent load with interlocks and H 4831 but I get better velocity and accuracy with IMR 4350 and Sierra gamekings. My 270 has a 22" barrel and the little faster burn rate seems to suit it better. 4451 is right next to it on the burn rate chart. What little published data I found shows it to make more velocity than 4350 in the 270 and the claim is temperature stability inline with the H extreme powders, which is my experience is pretty good. Sounded good enough on paper to see what it does at the range......

Willie T---Lone Star State
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budlight
Advanced Member



USA
1658 Posts

Posted - Jul 06 2017 :  01:20:00  Show Profile Send budlight a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Superformance and R-26 are the best powders for 270 win and 140 -150 gr Just use large rifle primers.

When 7828 and 7828SC came out 25 + Years ago it was my go to powder Then I did years of R-25, H1000, and retumbo.

Edited by - budlight on Jul 06 2017 01:26:59
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Willie T
Average Member

136 Posts

Posted - Jul 06 2017 :  13:10:08  Show Profile Send Willie T a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thanks budlight. I have not done anything with either of those powders. The boredom of summertime combined with a touch of OCD has me trying to find a load that combines the best qualities of the two I currently load for the 270win. I haven't done enough work with this rifle yet to find something I think is an optimal load for it yet.

Willie T---Lone Star State
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Kosh75287
Advanced Member



USA
796 Posts

Posted - Jul 06 2017 :  15:27:43  Show Profile Send Kosh75287 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I keep WANTING to try one of the ENDURON series of IMR powders, but I don't have a rifle that works and plays nicely with IMR-4451. I was thinking of getting a pound of whichever powder is in the "slower than IMR-3031, but faster than IMR-4320" burning range for my Garand, but the rifle's currently delivering "minute of washtub" accuracy, even with well-established reloads.

I may owe it to myself to go buy a bolt rifle chambered for "SuperHighVelocityMeatHomongenizer", just to piddle, but right now I have more rifles than I can optimize. Darn it...

God bless Jeff Cooper

Carpe SCOTCH!
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caveman0101
Senior Member



USA
238 Posts

Posted - Jul 06 2017 :  19:53:44  Show Profile Send caveman0101 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I worked up some loads with it for 300 WBY and 280 Rem. I added them to the load info on this sight. I also did my own extreme temp change test with Enduron 4451, H1000, R23. Of course the IMR and Alliant info was all about how their new tech was so much better for temp changes. The hodg beat them both. It only had @10fps change while IMR was @50Fps, R23 was@100FPS. The change in temp was from 80* to 30*.I went into this test with no bias, actually, I was hoping the R23 would be best because I had just bought 8lbs of it.

"It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt" Lincoln/Twain
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Willie T
Average Member

136 Posts

Posted - Jul 06 2017 :  20:06:05  Show Profile Send Willie T a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thank you caveman.

Willie T---Lone Star State
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RaySendero
Advanced Member



USA
635 Posts

Posted - Jul 07 2017 :  06:13:11  Show Profile Send RaySendero a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Willie T

Thanks for the reply Ray. I have a really consistent load with interlocks and H 4831 but I get better velocity and accuracy with IMR 4350 and Sierra gamekings. .....



Yep same with me again.
My accuracy load is IMR-4350 with a 150 Sierra GameKing.


Ray
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budlight
Advanced Member



USA
1658 Posts

Posted - Jul 08 2017 :  23:16:04  Show Profile Send budlight a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by RaySendero



Yep same with me again.
My accuracy load is IMR-4350 with a 150 Sierra GameKing.





Do you own or have ever used a chronograph? Reality in days gone by was Imr, AA, H4350 is good for 90, 100 , and 110 gr 270 win Even your diehard J Conners used 4831 in the 60's for 130's and that is because they didn't have anything better
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Willie T
Average Member

136 Posts

Posted - Jul 09 2017 :  11:50:00  Show Profile Send Willie T a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Budlight, yes I do. I am shooting 130's in a 22" barrel. The faster burn rate of IMR 4350 suits my rifle better than H 4831. Sometimes you can attain published velocity, sometimes you can't. Sometimes you can attain the velocity but it's not worth using cause it shoots like crap. Right now for what I have tried in this rifle, IMR 4350 is tops. Still looking to improve but based on what this rifle is doing, I'm gonna search the area around IMR 4350 on the burn chart first.

Willie T---Lone Star State
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budlight
Advanced Member



USA
1658 Posts

Posted - Jul 11 2017 :  11:50:17  Show Profile Send budlight a Private Message  Reply with Quote
willie T you did say 4350 and 150gr.

IMO - And I have done lots of loads with no data using burn rate charts. You can't trust the hodgdon one 100% even for their own powders. Or what about the powders not listed? It sucks. The AA chart is more correct.

I have in the past the 4 kinds of 4350 with light weight 270 rounds. You might want to experiment with Pwr Pro 3000-LR. H-100 V, Ram shot hunter. I don't even like rod powder!
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Willie T
Average Member

136 Posts

Posted - Jul 11 2017 :  19:07:21  Show Profile Send Willie T a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Budlight, thanks for the reply, and sharing your experience. If the 4451 does not pan out I will be trying something else. I've still got about 3 months of summer to kill. It is Ray with the 150 Sierra load. I am working on a 130 grain load for whitetail. In no way am I discounting 150's in a 270 but it's not what I'm working on right now. I'm trying to figure out if I can improve on the 130 loads I have worked up. Of the four powders I have tried in this rifle, 55 grains of IMR 4350 have suited it the best. I have had stellar accuracy in 2 other 270's with IMR 4350 so it is one of the first places I turn with a 270. I don't put much stock in the Hodgdon data usually either, but I do use it as a data comparison. I usually gravitate to data generated by the manufacturer of the Bullets I am loading. With 4451, data is still pretty sparce. Atleast in the five manuals I have on my bench, and I will be using hodgdon data. For my rifle stuff I'm ok with extruded powders and throwing light and trickling charges. The exception for me is some higher volume 223 stuff that I throw ball powder charges, and pistol stuff. Everything I do is single stage so none of it is too fast anyway.

Willie T---Lone Star State
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Shastaboat
Advanced Member



USA
9124 Posts

Posted - Jul 12 2017 :  06:45:19  Show Profile Send Shastaboat a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I haven't shot my .270 Win in probably 8 years but my data hasn't changed. Shooting Nosler 130 gr solid base, Speer 130, or Sierra 130 gr bullets.
Mauser Mark X, 24" barrel the following loads were tops with excellent accuracy.
57 gr of IMR4350, 3146 fps; 51.5 gr of IMR4064, 3175 fps; 62 gr of H4831 using a drop tube to get the powder into the case and then compressing that gave me only 3051 fps;

In a Savage 111. 62 gr of MR3100 gave me 3212 fps; 58 gr of Data 85 gave me 3123 fps; 57 gr of IMR4350 gave me 3197 fps; 62 gr of H4831 gave 3058 fps.

All of these loads were max for my load development and should be approached from several gr. below except for the H4831 loads. You just can't cram enough of that powder into a .270 Win case to show max pressure.

62.5 gr of H4831SC gave us 3127 fps in Budlight's 24" .270 Win.

Based on my prior load development 4350 would be the powder I'd choose for .270 Win but the H100V might beat it out in the velocity issue and do as well in accuracy. Budlight gave me a lb. of that powder to try on some other calibers as it is supposed to be very close to the 4350's in burn rate. I have found that to be the case. And as a ball powder it meters much better than 4350. I haven't tried it in the .270 Win.
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