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T O P I C    R E V I E W
roysclockgun Posted - May 18 2017 : 09:35:11
When I first left active duty Army in 1964 I began looking for a deer rifle. My friendly gun shop owner touted the "new" Model 70 Winchester in 284Win. telling me that it would soon replace the 270Win.

That was the first "new and improved" cartridge that I encountered, pushed by the manufacturer and by gun magazine writers as being the greatest cartridge ever produced.

Many armchair shooters raced to buy a rifle in the most recently introduced cartridge, only to shortly learn that ammo was difficult if not impossible to find, because the "world beater new" cartridge was not selling enough rifles in that caliber for the maker to keep turning them out and so, unless one hand loaded, the rifle became in military lexicon, unsupportable.

How many of those "wonderful, new cartridges" that failed in the market place can you name?

Recently the 6.5 Creedmore has been touted everywhere where rifles are seen. I did read up on that cartridge and not surprisingly, it is not a winner against the venable 308Win. in terms of bench rest shooting. Plus it is reported that the barrel life of the 6.5 Creedmoor, is only half that of the 308Win.!

When I had my clock shop in Maryland and had to get an FFL in order to sell a couple milsurp rifles out of my shop, I had customers come in to get me to order one of the latest "Whiz Bang" calibers being touted in one of the rifles chambered for it. I had one customer who came back year after year to trade in last year acquisition, un-fired, for something that he now thought that he had to have. The lever action 450 Marlin being just one of them.

While the 450 Marlin is all but dead, rifles in 45-70 are still being produced and sold to people who have the false idea that those heavy bullets can bust brush and still stay on the course upon which the were set.

We have discussed the topic many times; "What caliber rifles would you own, if you could only keep three?" Most of us agree that the number of calibers offered could be trimmed down to six, or less and still cover every hunting need worldwide.

I have to admit, I have carried a rifle in 280Rem. for years and have never put factory ammo through it. Whether I am correct or not, I believe that in it's class of cartridges, the 280Rem. is superior to all others. I have killed; elk, mule deer, pronghorn, white tail, wild hogs, coyote and ground hogs. Shooting out to 400 yards. Not world class shooting, but my own personal limit at age 74.

My most recent elk was taken in Colorado. A bull at 280 yds. using 160 grain Barnes Solids. It did the job without breathing heavy.

What is your favorite obsolete or hard to find cartridge that you use today?

Best,
Steven
15   L A T E S T    R E P L I E S    (Newest First)
EnglishTom Posted - Jun 04 2017 : 15:38:18
.577/450 303Brit 45-100 Sharps .455Webley
Shastaboat Posted - Jun 04 2017 : 14:32:46
If you really want a 7MM that is efficient go the 7x57AI route. Even in a decent small ring Mauser the performance is great. 52 gr of 4350 gives me 2970fps with 139/140 gr bullets in my small ring 93 Spanish Mauser actioned thumbhole sporter with a 22" Shilen barrel.
Shastaboat Posted - Jun 04 2017 : 14:20:03
quote:
Originally posted by Hockeynick39

quote:
Originally posted by roysclockgun

How is the 284Win. designated in mm? 7x what. I am away from home and cannot look at my books.




Probably a 7 x 55 mm.



Case length is 2.17"=55.18mm
I've not heard of anyone referring to this case in those terms though.
WonderMan4 Posted - Jun 04 2017 : 00:23:55
I bought my first 7x57 in 1971. I used the Speer HotCor 145 gr. and some charge of H4831.....I don't recall how much and can't locate my notes on that.

The old war horse had the open sights on it, but it could put the bullets where you aimed. I got very lucky with that.

I shot 3 Texas white tails with it in a 2 year period. They all went down without a run. I would say that gun would be an excellent piece for a female that doesn't like recoil as it had very little.

I still have it, but it is in the safe as a project gun for the future. Haven't shot it in quite a while.

I was able to find 5 boxes of new WW brass back then, so I have never shot a factory round thru it.
Paul B Posted - Jun 03 2017 : 14:29:26
A cartridge I'm beginning to take a big liking to is that ancient 1892 round called the 7x57 Mauser. At times I wonder why? As far has hunting goes, it's been a big time super jinx for me. First instance was way back in 1973. I bought a British made 1893 custom Mauser in 7x57 just before deer season. It was scoped so when the only ammo I could find in that small Nevada cowtown was the 175 gr. Federal load. Hardware store had exactly four boxed on the shelf and cut me a deal if I took all four. One box used to sight in and get used to the rifle and two days later on opening day I got a 35 yard shot on a standing two point Mule Deer. It took off on a dead run. Very little blood trail and couldn't find it. Went hope and got my wife to help me look and we tried until it was too dark to see. FWIW, I shot that deer at right around 8 in the morning. I went out the next day to the same place and found that deer. or at least what the coyotes and birds left so no way to even try an autopsy. I sold that rifle. Now that I',m playing with that cartridge I kind of wish I'd kept it.
Incident #2 found me hunting about 30 miles north of Wilcox AZ when I got a shot at a decent meat buck at roughly 85 to 100 yards. Rifle was an M70 Featherweight pushing the 140 gr. Nosler Ballistic Tip at 2800 FPS MV. Bullet hit square on the shoulder and a saw a large red spot at the hit plus a sharp crack like breaking a branch. The deer was with a small herd which ran uphill. The one I shot ran downhill into a gully and out of sight. I head up the ridge which was composed of loose rock and sure as hell, my right foot twisted one way and my body the other way. Heard a ripping sound and it was bye bye knee. My ex-son in law and his son were on the hunt and then came up to help me off the hill. I told them to let me wait here and they go down the gully and either bring it to me to tag or tag it themselves. They refused so the coyotes once again ate well thank to the jinx(??).

Now I'm playing three rifles chambered to the round, loading it to it's full potential AKA 7-08 velocity and getting interesting speed and great accuracy results. The question is, is this cartridge really a jinx or just a case of very bad luck?

I wish Winchester would do a run of their 145 gr. Power Point ammo in 7x57 as all three of my rifles like it and I prefer the brass. I have plenty to feed the FWT and #1 but I'd like to fire form with factory maybe 120 rounds or more expressly for the custom Mauser. Twenty for load work up with the 150 gr. Nosler Partition and the rest for a supply of hunting ammo that should last me the rest of my days.
Paul B.
Hockeynick39 Posted - Jun 03 2017 : 08:00:54
quote:
Originally posted by roysclockgun

How is the 284Win. designated in mm? 7x what. I am away from home and cannot look at my books.




Probably a 7 x 55 mm.
roysclockgun Posted - Jun 03 2017 : 07:13:11
How is the 284Win. designated in mm? 7x what. I am away from home and cannot look at my books.
Rapier Posted - Jun 01 2017 : 10:46:33
You know, after shooting one in HS, friend's father had one, years ago. I have often thought I would like to have a 351 SL. However, I am never in that mood when I actually see one for sale. I guess one day I will come across a shooter quality gun and just have to have it.
Ed
bad arrow Posted - Jun 01 2017 : 09:34:17
A hard to find cartridge that I use today?
That would be my 307win, perhaps obsolete but in a classic M94, I have shot a moose and several nice bucks.
Not a long range cartridge, fun to handload for and sneak around the bush with. Not my go to Mule/Moose rifle, but I do take it out Whitetailing often as the ranges are shorter.
It never seemed to catch on as a hunting cartridge for some reason, brass is hard to find but I may have enough to last me.
Bobo7mmmag Posted - May 31 2017 : 23:39:06
I remember picking up a .284 Win enpty brass round at a rifle range around 1979. It looked like a 7mm Mag with the ass end chopped off.

I still have it in my box of interesting rounds along with a 6.5 Carcano, .244 Rem, 6.5 x55 Swede ...etc...
roysclockgun Posted - May 29 2017 : 19:05:09
It all comes down to, for whatever reason, we get into certain calibers and in general, stick with them. The overlap of so many calibers that could be used in any situation is daunting to any newby. Usually what he chooses is based not on hard evidence and/or research, but on what his friends or relatives tell him. And so it goes.

The gun magazine writers must push the latest introduced cartridge as being totally new and a world beater. In truth, the shelf space into which the new cartridge will go is already covered three or four times over. However, many shooters like to chase the latest, new and improved offering, about which the gun magazine writers are crowing so loudly!
Steven
Hockeynick39 Posted - May 20 2017 : 19:06:35
Forgot the .405 Winchester, .45-70 Gov't, and the .404 Jeffery! Yeah, I like a big bore too!!!!!!
southdakbearfan Posted - May 20 2017 : 14:17:10
222 rem. turned many a thousand military 5.56 down to 222 rem. Still have 3 of them and always on the lookout for another.

257 roberts, although mine is an AI.

303 british
Paul B Posted - May 19 2017 : 17:12:05
quote:
Originally posted by budlight

Paul B. I own the 458X2 Barnes American. Cases are not hard to come by in lots of defunct rounds you just have to look up the parent case

375H&H is the parent of 458 win mag and the 458X2 Barnes wonderful round when using 405 gr Barnes X bullets

My other has the parent case of 7mm Mauser the 257Roberts AI



I understand completely. I make .375 Taylor ammo from 7MM Mag., .338 Mag and .458 Win. Mag. brass. I find the .458 the easiest to work with by just resizing and trimming just enough to square off the necks. I do the same with .338 brass. The 7 Mag brass has to have the necks opened using a couple of expanders. All shoot just fine.
Paul B.
budlight Posted - May 19 2017 : 10:30:09
Paul B. I own the 458X2 Barnes American. Cases are not hard to come by in lots of defunct rounds you just have to look up the parent case

375H&H is the parent of 458 win mag and the 458X2 Barnes wonderful round when using 405 gr Barnes X bullets

My other has the parent case of 7mm Mauser the 257Roberts AI

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